The Lion Heart Returns to Mongolia FOUR times with Beyond Expeditions
This article features an interview with Lishan, a four-time solo female adventurer who loves an unconventional adventure. In fact, she was part of Beyond Expeditions’ first group of clients, when we first started our Mongolia expeditions!
A picture of Lishan and a baby goat, taken during her trip to West Mongolia with Beyond Expeditions.
Lishan’s energy is comforting to be with. Kind of like a warm and steady breeze.
I wasn’t quite sure why that particular line you just read, was the very sentence I wanted to start this article with. But now that I’ve completed the article, I’m confident that when you read about how my interview with Lishan unfolded, you’ll understand why.
I’ve interviewed about eight of Beyond Expeditions’ participants by now, each person having gone one or two trips with Beyond Expeditions. But this next interviewee is pretty special; she went for FOUR Mongolian expeditions with Beyond Expeditions. I was shocked when I first learnt about that.
I mean, I’ve always believed that what Beyond Expeditions has to offer is extraordinary. But… four?! That is the most number of trips any traveler has embarked on with Beyond Expeditions.
In this article, you’ll be following us through our conversation, which happened within a 45-minute ZOOM session. To me, the best part about this article would be how you’ll get to understand not only why Lishan went for so many of their expeditions, but also experience what ‘alignment’ can look and feel like in a person. (This conversation reminded me that the way someone views the world is a reflection of the world she has built within herself. ) So join me in this refreshing conversation with Lishan, where you’ll get to see:
Mongolia’s beauty through her eyes.
Lishan’s childhood dream come true (involves dinosaur bones)
How Mongolians truly are.
What it means to “go with all your heart”, wherever you go.
Oh, and at the very end of this conversation, Lishan has some very honest advice for you, if you are thinking of whether to jump onboard a trip that Beyond Expeditions offers.
And no, it has nothing to do with just saying ‘yes’.
I wanted to know more about Lishan, quickly. So I plunged in with these questions;
“How would you describe yourself as a person? And also, what is one animal you feel best describes you?”
Lishan’s response came surprisingly fast, which I soon understood why.
A solo picture of Lishan in West Mongolia.
“So, I was thinking about the question as I was reading through the list of questions you sent yesterday! I will say… ‘authentic’.
Because I like authentic experiences! I'm drawn to natural places; nature is very healing for me. I’m not a fan of, you know, cities. I like to experience indigenous cultures, and tribes, that are rooted in tradition and untouched by tourism. So I was really happy about my latest trip with Beyond Expeditions, where I went to North Mongolia and got to see the reindeer herders.
Also, I read (the article featuring) your interview yesterday! The one with the young son and his family? I feel they’re such great role models, to bring a young child to these kinds of environments.
Her words brought a smile to my face, leaving a warmth in my heart. The conversation I had with Judy and Lucas was one I can still remember. They are truly one inspirational family.
“Lishan, I’m curious; What does being “authentic” mean to you?”
In a steady voice, Lishan replied. “To me, it’s about living in alignment with your values, your actions. It’s about how you express yourself, and the choices that you make in everything. For example, I decided to be a yoga teacher because I wanted to live in alignment with what matters to me.
I think it's also really important to see what you bring to other cultures when you visit them. For example, being open-minded, adventurous, willing to try out new things, and keeping an open mind to explore can help us best appreciate and respect what’s authentic for them.”
At this point, we were about five minutes into our conversation. I found myself thinking, “Wow, this woman’s energy is light-hearted, calm, and strong at the same time.”
I redirected Lishan to the second part of my earlier question, curious about the animal she’ll pick.
She thought for a moment, before selecting a lion. “I guess many people have said I’m a brave person. Scott was someone who said that too, probably because I was the first female to go on one of his planned Mongolian trips. This was before he started Beyond Expeditions; he had plans to organise a retreat expedition and wanted to include yoga as an element. So this trip to Mongolia was with Scott, two other guys… and yes, I was the only girl, a.k.a the yoga teacher. I said yes because, at that time, I had just graduated with a Bachelor’s in Communications, and felt this would be a perfect opportunity to explore somewhere more exotic. Also, it’s a way to celebrate my graduation!”
Lishan guiding fellow participants through a yoga routine, during the first trip to South Mongolia.
There’s something about the way she says “Mongolia”, that I felt hooked onto. I wanted to know more about how she truly feels about this country.
“As you're speaking, I can feel there’s something more in how you see this country. Like, there’s this way it comes out through your way of being. So…
Why do you love Mongolia?”
“I'm someone who likes to explore and I'm quite adventurous. I also love nature and culture very much. So Mongolia is somewhere that is very strong in that; the rawness, the raw ruggedness, the wilderness.”
Lishan leaned forward, her body fidgeting in what seemed like excitement as she continued speaking.
Lishan leading fellow expedition members in a yoga session during her first trip to Mongolia (South).
“My cousin went to Mongolia when he was in secondary school, for a volunteer program trip. I remembered how, when I saw his pictures, which was probably like, eight years before I went to Mongolia. I went, ‘Wow, this place is so beautiful.’
It's so different from all the other civilized places! That moment kept me thinking that, perhaps I should visit Mongolia someday.”
I smiled; young Lishan ended up having her dream come true.
“How would you describe the uniqueness of Mongolia's beauty?”
Lishan replied to the question without needing much time to think. “Well, being there is like being in a nature documentary. The scenes that you see every day are just epic! So if you want to experience the breathtaking beauty of nature, without any human destruction or any kind of civilization, Mongolia is the perfect place.
I've been there four times, and every region of Mongolia is quite different. My first trip was to the south of Mongolia, to the Gobi Desert. It's a lot of sand, dunes. Rocks. And then the second trip to central Mongolia was more of like; waterfalls, canyons, hills, valleys.”
In her second trip to Mongolia (Central), Lishan’s expedition members got to experience yoga too at the magical white lake Terkhiin Tsagaan Nuur.
Without pausing, Lishan rambled on happily.
“And then the third trip!
It was to West Mongolia, where it’s a more mountainous region, with snow-capped mountains. The way of living here is also slightly different. There are more concrete buildings than yurts.
West Mongolia Altai Mountains Region, May 2018
A picture Lishan took with a Kazakh nomad, and milk that came fresh from the yaks!
My last trip to North Mongolia? It's more in the forested area, closer to Siberia. It was full of forests, incredibly beautiful. The people living there use a lot of logs for their homes!”
Like Lishan describes; in North Mongolia, they use many logs for their teepees (Tsaatan huts).
Her eyes lit up as she described each of these four trips to Mongolia, and her enthusiasm for each region was contagious. I’d never been to any of these regions, but the note of appreciation she held for each region made me feel excited too.
“Do you personally have a favorite of all these four regions?”
Lishan chose the trip to North Mongolia.
“We rode the horses into the forest, which took about three to four hours each way. It's hard to get there. The reindeer herders are a really special group of people we got to meet every day. Also, everything was just so clean and pristine. And of course, meeting reindeer! Getting to interact with the reindeer, it's not something that you can get every day. Maybe horses and camels might be more common. And even so, those interactions are often quite ‘structured’.
Lishan sitting amongst an entire family of reindeer.
The reindeer herders showed us how to milk the reindeer; the milk was so nutritious! And then you get to eat butter, yogurt and curd.”
I gasped when I heard this. I don’t know about you, but this sounds like a dream to me.
“And then we were staying in those teepees, which is very unique because I've not tried that in the rest of Mongolia. That’s something I only saw in books or shows. But when I stayed in it, it was an entirely new experience.”
And then, she shared something that made me gasp again.
“I think the most amazing thing was that I celebrated my 29th birthday on this trip. They had this big bonfire for me and everyone was dancing around the fire! We took turns to sing… “
For a moment, Lishan’s mind seemed to wander back to that night itself.
“.. It felt truly magical, to celebrate the last year of my 20s this way.”
A carving on a piece of reindeer antler that the reindeer herders gifted to Lishan for her 29th birthday!
I nodded in agreement; it sounded like a magical way to celebrate a birthday indeed.
“Do you feel these four trips left you with a different perspective on certain things in your life when you returned to Singapore?”
Adjusting her posture, Lishan replied. “Yes, for sure! I think it’s because I meet different locals there. I see different kinds of living situations, and I see how resilient the nomads are.
They constantly shift their homes because the climate changes very quickly in Mongolia. To witness their way of living and surviving… they are really strong, both mentally and physically, to brave the elements of nature.
In Singapore, our lifestyle is very different. We just turn on the tap, we get to drink. For them, they have to go fetch water from the lake or a stream. If it's cold, they will boil the ice.”
“What were some memorable moments for you on this first trip to Mongolia?”
Lishan shared that when she was young, she had a fascination with dinosaurs. “So it was exciting when, on my first trip to the Gobi Desert, I got to see and touch dinosaur bones! To see actual dinosaur bones, like, the dinosaur remains in person? That was amazing.
She thought about it for a moment, before remembering that she really appreciated the hospitality of the of the driver and the cook too. “Especially because in this first trip, I was practising vegetarianism. I was touched by how she (the cook) took the effort to create special meals for me.”
“Was there anything you learnt about who you are as a person through this first trip to Mongolia?”
Lishan pondered for a bit.
“Hmm, I learnt that I'm actually very resilient. Living in Mongolia, sometimes I don't get to bathe for maybe three to five days. I learnt that I can live without all these material comforts, and still thrive and feel very connected and joyful because of the authentic connections I experienced with the culture there and how beautiful nature is.”
“How about your second Mongolian trip; what was memorable for you then?”
“The second trip had a much bigger group of people,” Lishan said, explaining that the huge increase in numbers was probably because Scott was slowly starting to expand his business back then. “Oh, I remember celebrating my 24th birthday during that trip, and another group member also celebrated her 27th birthday!”
“There was also this one point where the van got stuck on a muddy slope, so we had to stop. One of the very friendly locals offered us arak, which is a slightly alcoholic drink made from a fermented mare's milk. Then, we all got down to help push the Russian van together.
I love these kinds of experiences. It shows the teamwork of the expedition members, and how warm and friendly the locals are. I’m guessing for Mongolians, they have to rely on one another a lot more compared to us city people, who are more independent and isolated. Being with them (the Mongolians), the kindness spreads. We help one another very easily and quickly, which is sometimes absent in a city culture where we don't feel this closeness.
So after that trip, I value having a community now that I've experienced these kinds of beautiful, beautiful people who are so helpful.”
Lishan with a beautiful rainbow across the sky, in North Mongolia.
“Communities and connections you had built?”
Lishan nodded excitedly.
“Definitely! I made a lot of good friends during all four trips. Also, I got some gigs too. I was freelancing as an actress back then, and I managed to get certain jobs from there. Most importantly, I made friends I could deepen my friendships with.”
“Do you have a motto in life that you live by?”
Lishan selected this quote by Confucius.
“Wherever you go, go with all your heart.”
I’d personally never heard of this quote, and the moment I heard it, it somehow made sense to me.
She proceeded to explain that, “... To me, that means being fully committed to the trip, and fully immersing myself in the environment in a different place. Bringing all of me, wholeheartedly.
It also applies to other things in life, whereby whenever I try something new, I give it my all and receive all of whatever comes.
I feel like the heart is the center of your mind and also your body. It represents our humanity, and how we are all connected and loving people.”
Remember that at the start of the article, Lishan shared that authenticity is something that matters very much to her? It all made sense to me now. This is a woman who is very intentional in the way she navigates the world.
Lishan lovingly embracing a dog during her trip to North Mongolia.
We continued our conversation, causally bouncing off each other’s input; me with her responses, her with my questions. Somehow, we arrived at the topic of her relationship with nature, which opened up an insightful piece from Lishan:
“Being in nature reminds me of why I’m here.
It puts all my problems into perspective. As you know, in Singapore, we face these first-world problems and have many complaints. But when I experience these different ways of living in Mongolia, it reminds me that I can live in different ways as well. Sometimes, we get so stuck on certain patterns of thinking, wishing to be like ‘this’, wishing a life should be like ‘that’. But when you open your mind and see how different people in different places are living, you realise, ‘Hey, there's a lot of possibilities around what a good life means to me.’
And it doesn't just have to look a certain way, which is unfortunately what is quite expected in our society.”
At this point, we had spent about 37 minutes together. To wrap up the conversation, I asked a question that I myself am always most curious to hear about, from the participants I interview.
“Honestly, many other travel agencies also bring participants to unconventional places. What do you feel sets Beyond Expeditions apart?”
Lishan pondered for a moment, but surprised me with a prompt answer.
“Beyond Expeditions is very community-focused. Besides the trip itself, we have these meet-ups at Beyond Expeditions’ base camp, where we’ll get to meet other travelers for a briefing session. I enjoy getting to connect with these travellers who are going on different dates to the same country. Beyond Expeditions also host all these fun workshops like wood chopping campfire, for local outdoor adventurers as well. So there's like, a community that is growing, rather than just… ‘I book the trip dates, and then I go to this exotic place. Done.’
I value this sense of connectedness I get to have with other like-minded travelers.”
A picture of Lishan with her fellow expedition members in West Mongolia.
If you’re reading this and you enjoy traveling solo, but with other people who are ‘like you’... then Beyond Expeditions is meant for you.
And down to my last question with Lishan:
“What would you say to someone who is considering joining a trip with Beyond Expeditions?”
Note your preferences! For example, I would avoid trips during winter, and choose trips that go in spring, summer, and autumn. So for my Mongolia trips, twice I went in May, which is spring, and then twice in August, which is the start of autumn. And I’m heading off to Ladakh in July, which is the middle of summer!
I believe this picture best captures Lishan’s excitement for her upcoming trip to Ladakh! (Taken in West Mongolia)
Taking my preferences into consideration is important because in Singapore, our weather is quite sunny all year round, but the weather in other countries can be very extreme. So I feel for your first trip, picking the right season to go is quite important.
And also, maybe be clear about the type of experiences you want. For example, in each of the four regions of Mongolia I visited, the experience is quite different. In certain areas, you’ll find yourself riding horses, then in other areas, you’ll be riding camels. In some areas, you’ll meet reindeer, while in some, you’ll meet the eagle hunters. So the kind of experiences that you're seeking, if you're just you know, picking like a first trip.
Lastly, also to keep an open mind. As you know, we are very materially pampered here in Singapore. When you travel to the countries Beyond Expeditions offers, you might get a culture shock in the first three days. Take your time to adjust.
But also, don't worry, because the way Beyond Expeditions plans our trips, it’s a gradual adjustment. Usually, you’ll first be in the city, before going closer into nature. So you will get that time to adjust!
And lastly, go with all your heart.
Read about the interviews I’ve had with other Beyond Expeditions participants here below; you may just find the inspiration you need, to travel beyond.
Article: For this family, Mongolia wasn’t just about reindeer.
Article: Not just ‘another trip’ for these four solo female travelers [Part 1]
Article: Not just ‘another trip’ for these four solo female travelers [Part 2]
Article: A Cancer Survivor’s Greatest Takeaways from Cancer and Adventure [Beyond Limits 4]
Article: How this charity expedition nudged her to unleash growth and a new self. [Beyond Limits 4]
Article written by: Valerie
Valerie, a freelance writer with a quirky infatuation with steamed buns and slightly bizarre food combinations.
(“Try soft-boiled eggs and hot milo!”)
She wishes to keep writing stories that bypass typical food reviews and appreciation of scenery, stories that inspire readers to pursue curious conversations about the unique cultures and lifestyles of every country.
